Originally posted by SGT.L: the problem is that a vast majority of CSS are not earning their CAB by taking the fight to the enemy. They are sitting on a FOB where indirect hits, or on a convoy and one of the trucks in the mix gets hit and everyone gets a CAB for showing up. Some do earn it and im not taking that away from them, but for the first time CSS soldiers get a chance of the piece of the pie and are taking advantage of it and i dont agree with it. But hey thats my opinion and it is shared by an awful lot of people who have witnessed this, so im definatly in my lane with my ascertation.
Maybe you need to read up on regulations. Just because you are on a FOB when incoming hits, doesn't mean you get a CAB. You have to be within a certain distance, which is not very far, from the blast area. Same as when you are on a convoy. But on the other hand, a 11B can get a CIB while assigned to an unit, no matter what he did, because it is blanketed to the unit.
My first deployment, our motor pool got bombarded with mortar rounds, rocket attacks, and even a few small arms attacks. I got shot at numerous amount of times doing recovery missions in the city. I had an IED damage my vehicle while going to a recovery mission. And I did not receive a CAB. But infantrymen in my unit that stayed in the talk received CIB. Hmmm. My second deployment I hit an IED during a convoy and got a CAB for it. Personally, I think I deserved it on my first deployment and not my second. But it don't even matter because I don't wear it. Hell, I don't even wear a combat patch.
Posts: 18 | Location: In route. | Registered: 07 September 2007
We had 5 soldiers who didnt receive CIB's the initial invasion due to TOC duty so that argument doesnt stand. The COC decided who gets what. If you decide not to wear any combat patches thats your perogative, i will continue to wear mine because it reminds me of the friends that i lost in war, and its a commemeration to them, but hey different MOS's different mentality. Bottom line is keep your soldiers safe and if you want accolades be an officer.
I understand where you are coming from Sgt L. Everyone has their own reasons why they earned their CAB/CIB etc. It's a never-ending arguement.
For me being a CAV guy, I don't wear my CAB or my combat patch, which for me I deemed my "deployment" patch when I saw soldiers stationed in Kuwait wearing them. I know what I did in OIF and OEF, for me I don't need any patch/badge to prove it. That's just my two cents.
IF YOU AIN'T CAV, YOU AIN'T SHIT...
Strength does not come from physical capacity. It comes from an indomitable will...
Posts: 71 | Location: Ft Knox, KY | Registered: 28 June 2007
That's a similar mentality to end of tour awards that people get. For instance all the squad leaders were put in for bronze stars, and reduced to arcoms. The mail room nco received an arcom as well and people were upset because after a year deployed on constant combat patrols as infantry and they received the same award as the mail room guy.
My point is, you are receiving an award for your service. If you don't feel you earned it, ask to have it taken away when you're being put in for it.
If someone else gets an award and doesn't feel like they earned it, they should be the ones not to wear it, not you. Why should you take off an award because someone else who you don't think deserves it gets one too...
Same goes for the combat patch. You earned it. Because you don't feel someone else does shouldn't affect whether or not you earned the right to wear it.
Also remember, if the department of the army deems that they or their unit met the time requirements for a combat patch, regardless of location, what does it matter to you?
Okay I'm just rambling now. End state: be proud of your actions, conduct, and military work. Wear your awards with pride. You've probably worked very hard to earn them. And if you are one of those people who didn't, please just don't be a shitbag and make us all look bad roger?
Ok you guys crack me up, you go on about how the CAB means nothing to you because qoute "fobbits" wear them, you need to study a little history. We are fighting an unconventional war, there are no fronts, back in WWII, and other past wars, the only soldiers who had to worry about shelling were the ones directly on the battlefield. Everyone else was pushed back. If a soldier is shot at in a convoy shouldn't he have just as much right to wear the badge as anyone else. What if he had been killed from that one incident, would you still say he doesn't deserve it. I am an E-5 artilleryman, I just got back from NTC, and all we are preparing to do in Iraq when we deploy is infantry stuff. You can't judge just because of MOS, or just because they were only in one firefight, it doesn't matter. Danger close for a 60mm mortar is 200 meters by army standard, did you know that. And oh by the way the reg is for soldiers engaging OR being engaged.
There were 24 people in the platoon total to answer your question 35m3. Next question to you Artilleryman.......when you get in a firefight you dont look for awards you try and survive, engage the enemy, and then eliminate them and then charlie mike. Hopefully NTC has turned into something it used to not be, because when i was there it was absolutely nothing like war, and ive been deployed 35 months total . And personally danger close in Iraq is close as your rear end to the seat you are sitting on right now. Like i said if you shot your weapon at a combatant or your truck or you were blown up then you should receive the CAB either was keep your soldiers safe and get back to work.
I personally don't care whether someone actually "earned" their CAB, CMB, or CIB. I would consider it kind of rude to question the integrity of a soldier wearing his Combat badge or ask what he did to deserve it. Bottom line is someone with more rank than I approved that soldier for the wear of it. How they earned it, makes no difference. Are there soldiers out there who wear a badge for being on a FOB being mortared a few times? The answer is yes. Do they deserve it? Not my place to make that call. And for the record, Medics are authorized the CAB. To earn a CIB, a medic must be assigned to, attached to, or in support of an infantry unit to recieve the CMB. In other words, the medic needs to be side by side his counterparts who are recieving the CIB to get the CMB. All others qualify for the CAB.
Originally posted by SGT.L: There were 24 people in the platoon total to answer your question 35m3. Next question to you Artilleryman.......when you get in a firefight you dont look for awards you try and survive, engage the enemy, and then eliminate them and then charlie mike. Hopefully NTC has turned into something it used to not be, because when i was there it was absolutely nothing like war, and ive been deployed 35 months total . And personally danger close in Iraq is close as your rear end to the seat you are sitting on right now. Like i said if you shot your weapon at a combatant or your truck or you were blown up then you should receive the CAB either was keep your soldiers safe and get back to work.
As impressed as I am with someone who has almost three years of total deployment and is still an E5, I think we will just revert to whoever with rank makes the regs. I don't like wearing a beret. Guess what? Someone else approved it so you might as well just shut up and do the job instead of whining about it.
I get so sick of you infantry guys with this high and mighty mentality. Everyone is fighting the same damn mission, away from the families, etc. This inter-branch/inter-MOS bickering gets old. How do you think we catch these bad guys? Mainly because you infantryman just happen upon them or maybe the intel guys are out on the streets running dangerous source operations and tip your commander in the right direction? You don't see me spouting about how dangerous it is (as far as bragging to someone as opposed to showing you a point), etc. How about you go into a remote location in the Hindu Kush Mountains in civilian clothes and a beard (the only one in the entire convoy, by the way, so you are a perfect target) without armor or sometimes even weapons to build rapport with potential terrorists? At the MOST on missions I wore an IBA and a 9mm. I have done more than most infantry guys I know being embedded with SOF, Marines, OCF, OGA/CIA/DIA, etc.
We're all on the same team!
GET OVER YOURSELVES.
If someone got a CAB, why do you give a shit so much? Just for the record, I don't have one. I think it's a stupid award, just like the CIB. I was put in for one this last deployment and I had them take my name off the submittal list. And I never bothered to track down my artillery unit that I was with during the invasion because it's not worth my time for a stupid award. But equally stupid is the people that spend all this time bitching about how stupid it is.
Just re-read my post. It reads "To earn a CIB, a medic must be assigned to, attached to, or in support of an infantry unit to recieve the CMB." Should read to earn the CMB......to recieve the CIB. All these C*B's are getting confusing. Can't we just do like the Marines/Navy and have a Combat Action Ribbon instead?
This is my last post on this topic as it is spiraling downwards quickly.
Every unit / mos is going to have personal pride. Airborne v. Legs. Combat MOS v. Combat Support / Support. ETC ETC. People are proud of their units, people think their units are better than others. That's the pride that the unit commanders and NCO's have instilled in their soldiers. It is a good thing. Esprit de corps is a very good thing. They might say some over the top stuff like "if you ain't cav you ain't shit", or "if you want awards, go infantry, otherwise shut your hole". But the fact of the matter is that they just love what they do and the unit they do it with.
Slap them on the back, tell them to drive on, and hope that they do good things. I'd say the same for you. Some of you guys are getting personally offended by it. It's the wrong answer. Understand where it comes from, and do your mission, and drive on.
Not to mention very few people in this group have the decision making rank to change any of the policies you disagree with. So they are just expressing their thoughts. As are you.
One of the Soldiers asked me in formation, "SFC Mac' do you miss the Corps? Would you rather still be in the Marines or do you enjoy being in the Army?" I just replied, "I am standing here right in front of you wearing this uniform so that should answer your question." We are in a very difficult situation as far as our Armed Forces go, while here we are discussing the merits and worth of the CAB badge, who rates it vs. who does not, the differences between Combat Arms and CSS, etc. Soldiers are dealing with a lot of additional crap like loss of marriages, PTSD, adjusting to disability, loss of buddies in combat, etc. BLUF: We all wear a uniform, we are all serving in different units (some that are more high speed or high spirit than others) but we have the same main mission. You know if you rate the award or not and for those who feel that they just can't live without busting someone out if they think they rate a patch or not, my advice is you need to focus on other things. Focus on your fellow Soldiers not what he/she is wearing on their Blues or Class A's. Too many Soldiers are in need of guidance not verbal abuse because they haven't been where you have been. Give respect where it is due and remember that in combat the person next to you might not have the same skill levels as yourself but they wear the same uniform and will risk their life to save yours. Give them their dues and watch each others back. All the rest of this is pure opinion and discussion.
Posts: 225 | Location: 513th MI BDE, Fort Gordon, GA | Registered: 06 July 2006
to SGT. L.....I think you are confused, I don't know where you got in that reply I posted that I have never been to combat, and yes NTC has changed drastically. I am no stranger to combat, I have been outside the wire, I have been shot at, I have shot back. You were completely missing the point, and oh by the way I should be arriving in Baghdad on December 9th........AGAIN. The point I was trying to make was that it doesn't matter if you have been shot at once or a hundred times you are still in mortal danger, and it only takes that once to earn the award. We had a construction engineer that never left the wire but a couple of times, then when he did his convoy was ambushed, and he was killed holding off the enemy, if he had lived would you say he didn't deserve recognition, whatever, I am sure he wasn't thinking of getting an award while he was doing it either.