[quote:9f8ba16e65]I am counseling you for the conduct noted above. If this conduct continues, action may be initiated to separate you from the Army under AR 635-200, Chapters 5, 9, 13, or 14. If you are involuntarily separated, you could receive an Honorable discharge, a General, under honorable conditions, discharge, or an Under Other Than Honorable conditions discharge. An Honorable discharge may be awarded under any provision. A General discharge may be awarded for separation UP Chapters 5, 9, 13, and 14. An Under Other Than Honorable conditions discharge may be awarded for separation UP Chapter 14. If you receive an Honorable discharge, you will be qualified for most benefits resulting from military service. An involuntary Honorable discharge, however, will disqualify you from reenlistment for some period of time and may disqualify you from receiving transitional benefits (e.g., commissary, housing, health benefits) and the Montgomery G.I. Bill. If you receive a General discharge, you will be disqualified from reenlisting in the service for some period of time and you will be ineligible for some benefits including the Montgomery G.I. bill. If you receive an Under Other Than Honorable conditions discharge, you will be ineligible for reenlistment and for most benefits including payment for accrued leave, transportation of dependents and household goods to home, transitional benefits and the Montgomery G.I. Bill. You may also face difficulty in obtaining civilian employment, as employers have a low regard for the General and Under Other Than Honorable conditions discharges. Although there are agencies to which you may apply to have the character of your discharge changed, it is unlikely that any such applications will be successful. [/quote:9f8ba16e65]
Hope this helps! SGT I
Posts: 102 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 08 December 2003
If you go to Clothing Sales or your Army book store and purchase the book called "The Mentor" there is an excellent counseling statement that explains everything more clearly they the blurp on the bottom. Each counseling statement does not need that statement. Simply attach this one counseling statement to the other when diciplinary actions should occur.
waht is the actual regulation that says we must include the 'bad soldier' statement on the counseling. i've always been told to put it there, but no one can say reg XXX is why we do it and i cannot find the reg that says to do it.
Posts: 66 | Location: Camp Humpreys, ROK | Registered: 06 February 2004
1) the statement does not have to be on there for the soldier to receive UCMJ action.
2) the orgins of this statement are in AR 635-200, para. 1-16. It states that before a soldier is involuntarily seperated he/she must be informed of his/her deficientcies, that they could lead to discharge, the types of discharge the conduct could lead to, and the prejudicial effects in the civilian world, and given an opportunity to overcome his/her deficientcies. So basically this "magic statement" (or "1-16 counseling" as we call it") is only needed if you think you may need to seperate the soldier.
Hey, thats some good info. I always thought it had to be there for the soldier to recieve UCMJ. Actually I had always been told it was supposed to be there any time a soldier got an adverse counseling statement. I will still probably put it in my negative counseling statements, but it's nice to know that I don't have to.
Could a local JAG say or strongly "reccomend" that it needed to be in there?
Posts: 215 | Location: Ft. Lewis | Registered: 24 October 2005
If they have their heads, well you know, they could "require" or "strongly reccomend" it be there. but then you just pull out the old "show me in regulation where it says it has to be there!" Its not a bad idea to include it on all your negative counselings, because you never know when a soldier is going to go off the deep end, and need to be separated.
This is a little off topic, but I understand that when we counsel a soldier for something they did wrong, we consider it a "negative counseling". However, we should try to get away from the term. All counselings should be positive, and not meant to just tell a soldier what they did wrong, but how to fix the problem and have a positive outcome.
Well the problem is that some SGTs are too lazy to write up "atta-boys" and soldiers tend to see all counseling as negative. At least that was what I was getting from SSG G.'s post.
"War is an act of force, and to the application of that force there is no limit. Each of the advisaries forces the hand of the other, and in a recipricol action results in which there can be no limit..." Carl von Clausewitz, on war, 1833
Posts: 290 | Location: Fort Riley, KS | Registered: 20 May 2004
I think this is what you're looking for. Hope it helps.
IAW AR 635-200, Chapter 1, Paragraph 1-16, you are being counseled for the above indicated misconduct and/or unsatisfactory duty performance. Continued behavior of this kind can result in separation action being initiated under Chapter 14 para. 14-12(a), (b), or (c), Acts of Patterns of Misconduct, or Chapter 13, Separation of Unsatisfactory Performance, to eliminate you from the U.S. Army prior to the expiration of your term of service. Further acts of misconduct could result in your elimination from the U.S. Army without further counseling IAW Paragraph 1-16, AR 635-200. If you are separated for misconduct, you could receive one of the following types of discharges:
1. UNCHARACTERIZED 2. HONORABLE 3. GENERAL 4. UNDER OTHER THAN HONORABLE