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Dissrespecting an NCO, 2nd cousenling. Need advice on corrective action.
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So I have this E-4 who is sharp as a tack but lacks self control regarding her temper and has a history of borderline disrespect and sometimes outright disrespect when speaking to Officers & NCOs. She actually reminds me of myself when I was that young. Being a smart E-4, expert in my field (25B) and thinking I was smarter than my superiors, but I was dumb as a rock when it came to how I SHOULD speak to them. Actually, I know I was smarter and most time right in my operational suggestions but I learned the hard way that means nothing regarding respecting the Rank, not the Man/Woman. The difference was, I was a brand new E-5 and that learning experience cost me 3 years on my promotion towards E-6...but that's besides the point.

My E-4 was previously counseled for failure to adhere to a lawful order from an NCO (me). She let her temper get the best of her and sent a very disrespectful E-mail to my direct superior (Team Sergeant) after I specifically told her not to take any actions regarding that E-mail. (It was sent to me, not her but she read it off my screen.) In the counseling, I explicitly stated the events and noted she has been verbally counseled multiple times regarding her demeanor towards her superiors. I did cite a violation of Article 91 and possibility of UCMJ for continued violations.

Since then, she has not disobeyed a direct order but I have seen no progress regarding her demeanor. She still reluctantly complies with directives she disagrees with, after being told multiple times, she still has not learned what "offline" means when stating her grievances and still speaks to her NCOs in her chain in a disrespectful fashion while in the presence of other soldiers/NCOs.

Previous corrective action was for her to present to the team a Class on "What makes an Effective Army Leader" focusing on AR 600-20 chapter 4 & FM 6-22. And I wrote, "Through this plan of action I expect you to obtain a higher understanding of Leadership, Character, outlined in FM 6-22, specifically in the areas of: Respect, Military & Professional Bearing, Emotional attributes & Self-control." She missed the deadline I gave for her to present me with an outline of the class, was counseled for that, and when she did give her class, it was crap!

I've since had to had to verbally counsel her again in a "You will not blank blank blank to me in that tone" and pulled her to the side in a "I wouldn't do that if I were you" manner when appropriate. I'm counseling her again for the 3rd time in writing and need suggestions for corrective action.
 
Posts: 4 | Registered: 29 May 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

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Well Since this is your 3rd counseling for her. I would recommend her for an art. 15 for disrespect.
Its sounds pretty cut and dry, she hasn't learned her lesson the first 2 times. Then correct training doesn't seem to fix this, its time to take her time and money maybe that will strike a cord with her.
 
Posts: 29 | Registered: 17 April 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

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Dito what ArtillarySSG said. 3rd times the charm, in the case to recommending UCMJ. It sounds like you have given her more than a fair chance to identify the problem and correct it. At this point maybe a slightly bigger boot then you have is appropriate. Have you talked to your PSG or 1SG about the issue and gotten their thoughts?


CW3 Troy Ward
NETOPS OCT
Bronco 30E
National Training Center, Fort Irwin, CA

Are you a signal warrant officer? http://www.signal-chief.com/
 
Posts: 609 | Location: National Training Center, Fort Irwin, CA | Registered: 26 October 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post

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Don't I need "the next occurrence will result in processing of an Article 15?" written on a counseling?

Oh and....what's a PSG????????

Naw, I joke. :-) But seriously, we're not a line unit and so we work in small teams of 4 to 5. My "Team Sergeant" is the closes equivalent to a Platoon Sergeant. Everyone from the Team Sergeant to the Team Leader (CPT) has seen this behavior first hand, and likely spoken to her about it..though our discussions on corrective actions have never gotten to the Arti 15 level.

If it makes any difference, we're Reservists currently deployed to Afghanistan with only 3 months left in country. At that point, our team will be split, go back to Reserve status and sent to our parent units all over the US.
 
Posts: 4 | Registered: 29 May 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

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No you need to put in the counseling that you have given her multiple attempts to fix this issue, and that you have counseled her multiple times to fix the issue, but at this time you are recommending an art. 15 for her.
 
Posts: 29 | Registered: 17 April 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

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Disrespecting an NCO?

<deleted, DW>

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Daddy Warcrimes,
 
Posts: 20 | Location: Washington DC / Classified | Registered: 13 June 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of CrisTama
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quote:
Originally posted by SuperCAG/SEAL Sniper Santos:
Disrespecting an NCO?

He should be smoked without water until he dies of heat stroke. Bury his worthless ass in the woodline.


Really?!?!?! This is why you signed up on this forum?
 
Posts: 665 | Location: All over the world | Registered: 03 August 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post

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<deleted, DW>

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Daddy Warcrimes,
 
Posts: 20 | Location: Washington DC / Classified | Registered: 13 June 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of CrisTama
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by SuperCAG/SEAL Sniper Santos:
<deleted, DW>


Go away...

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Daddy Warcrimes,
 
Posts: 665 | Location: All over the world | Registered: 03 August 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of 11BIN3ID
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by CrisTama:
quote:
Originally posted by SuperCAG/SEAL Sniper Santos:
<deleted, DW>


Go away...

This seal/sniper/ranger santos is obviously some 400 lb 12 year old who plays too damn much call of duty.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Daddy Warcrimes,
 
Posts: 991 | Registered: 12 November 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post

posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 11BIN3ID:
quote:
Originally posted by CrisTama:
quote:
Originally posted by SuperCAG/SEAL Sniper Santos:
<deleted, DW>


Go away...

This seal/sniper/ranger santos is obviously some 400 lb 12 year old who plays too damn much call of duty.

<deleted, DW>

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Daddy Warcrimes,
 
Posts: 20 | Location: Washington DC / Classified | Registered: 13 June 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

posted Hide Post
<deleted, DW>

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Daddy Warcrimes,
 
Posts: 20 | Location: Washington DC / Classified | Registered: 13 June 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of LegalEagle
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I have been a JAG Paralegal for a few years now. The best bet in circumstances like these is reccomend a Summarized Article 15. The SM can't be reduce and isn't subjected to a forfeiture. Just 14 days restriction and 14 days extra duty. If it keeps continuing after that the next best bet would be a Company or Field Grade ART 15.
 
Posts: 4 | Location: FLW, MO | Registered: 19 January 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of MatthewAngel
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Sorry for asking this but what is an ART 15?


"Optimates Omnipotens ac Schola"
 
Posts: 25 | Location: Canada | Registered: 12 July 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of MatthewAngel
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Eh..still waiting for a reply, lol.


"Optimates Omnipotens ac Schola"
 
Posts: 25 | Location: Canada | Registered: 12 July 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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