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I have to counsel one of my soldiers on "Lying to an NCO". I have never had to do this one before and I am kind of stuck on how to discuss, and put on paper. Any help or examples would be great....Thanks in advance...
 
Posts: 196 | Location: Ft. Leonard Wood | Registered: 28 August 2003Report This Post

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Need more information - and the context of the "lie" is very important. Article 107 of the UCMJ deals with [i:086786b944]False Official Statements[/i:086786b944], and might cover the misconduct.

Verbal statements do fall under this, as the MCM defines an official statement as [i:086786b944]all documents and statements made in the line of duty[/i:086786b944]. Again, I'd need to know specifics to see if it really falls under 107 or if it should be addressed somewhere else under UCMJ.

If the counseling is going to go to the Commander and to JAG, you need to have it perfect, so there's no question as to whether or not the soldier was completely informed as to the nature of the offense and the potential consequences.

Generally, you want to start off with a by-the-book description of the offense taken straight from the MCM. For example:
[i:086786b944]In that PVT Joe Snuffy, did, at E Co/111 Inf Bde, Ft. Swampy, on or about 29 October 2004, with intent to deceive, make to SFC John Wayne an official statement, to wit: (word for word what came out his mouth), which statement was totally false (or false in that - with details), and was then known by him to be false[/i:086786b944].

Follow that with more detail in your own words, and be sure that you state you are recommending the soldier for an Article 15 on the counseling statement if that is your plan. Go through your 1SG to the Commander with any recommendation for Art 15.

BTW, don't forget to close Part III of the 4856 with the magic paragraph for JAG that covers all the potential repercussions of misconduct:
[quote:086786b944]You are being counseled for the actions stated in Part II, Background Information, above. Separation action may be initiated under AR 635-200 if this conduct continues. Such a separation action may result in a characteristic of service of either Uncharacterized, Honorable, General, or Under Other Than Honorable Conditions (UOTH). If you receive an UOTH discharge., you would not be eligible for payment of accrued leave, wear of the military uniform, admission to a soldier's home, civil service retirement credit, civil service unemployment compensation and naturalization benefits. If you receive a honorable discharge, you would be entitled to all benefits. If you receive an uncharacterized discharge, you may not be eligible for benefits. If you receive less than an honorable discharge, you can expect to encounter significant prejudice in civilian life. Any early separation action might result in recoupment of unearned enlistment bonuses, a loss of G.I Bill educational benefits, and no separation pay, if you were otherwise qualified. You should also know that if such conduct continues, you may be subject to a bar to reenlisment under AR 601-280, a written reprimand under AR 630-5, Paragraph 11-2, flagging action under AR 600-8-2, and other adverse administrative action. Finally, you should know that such conduct may subject you to punishment under the Uniform Code of Military Justice.[/quote:086786b944]

Hope that helps.
 
Posts: 79 | Registered: 22 October 2004Report This Post

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Thanks, helps alot..
 
Posts: 196 | Location: Ft. Leonard Wood | Registered: 28 August 2003Report This Post


USAR Career Counselor
Picture of Daddy Warcrimes
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Back it up with with a sworn statement (DA 2823) to give it added credability.
 
Posts: 3566 | Location: 13th BN ARCD, AZ | Registered: 15 February 2004Report This Post

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[quote:5061d6e607="Daddy Warcrimes"]Back it up with with a sworn statement (DA 2823) to give it added credability.[/quote:5061d6e607]

WOW :shock: Never heard anyone do that (I do like it though!)...but if it's a first offense I don't recommend it.
 
Posts: 1093 | Location: web surfing hell | Registered: 31 March 2004Report This Post

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Always include a sworn statement....1st offense or not. That being said, use common sense in regards to the extent of the violation. I would hope not to have to explain myself further because I don't want to insult anyone's intelligence.

Soldiers 1st....Mission Always!!!!
Supertankman23 SSG O'Connor
 
Posts: 11 | Registered: 07 January 2005Report This Post

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I need help I just took over a Sqaud and I need to give some initail counselings soon can some one help me?
 
Posts: 1 | Registered: 10 February 2007Report This Post


USAR Career Counselor
Picture of Daddy Warcrimes
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We sure can. But reviving a thread that has been dead for over 2 years is not the best way of getting it.

Use the search function to try to find your answer. If you can't find anything, or need additional input on a specific detail, post a new thread.
 
Posts: 3566 | Location: 13th BN ARCD, AZ | Registered: 15 February 2004Report This Post
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