I tried looking around in AR 600-20 and a few other locations but I've found no formal answer. If you have a soldier, off duty and in civilians, that you just wanted to provide a quick corrective drop for, nothing serious enough to warrant UCMJ or changing into uniform, could you do it?
I wouldn't see why you couldn't. I would say that if it is not that serious then you should have some tact as to where you do it. No point in embarrassing a soldier over something stupid.
"Sic Vis Pacem Para Bellum"
Posts: 193 | Location: Fort Hood | Registered: 10 December 2007
What caused the corrective action was offpost but the correction itself waited until the soldier was back on post to avoid embarrassment. Basically got dropped to be reminded of the rank structure. Nothing serious but did need to be done.
"You can't drop me, I'm in civilians."
Technically, you could say go change into PTs then but is it necessary? I would think for an all out corrective exercise session it would be but for say, 50 PUs it wouldn't be.
Originally posted by Vipes: I tried looking around in AR 600-20 and a few other locations but I've found no formal answer. If you have a soldier, off duty and in civilians, that you just wanted to provide a quick corrective drop for, nothing serious enough to warrant UCMJ or changing into uniform, could you do it?
A quick corrective drop? What are you doing, following him? Is he your pet project? Why not leave him alone? If he is off duty then why are you bothering him. I understand if he's wrong then he's wrong, but these guys are adults, and while we all understand that upon enlistment you are the property of the Army, you gotta give the guy a break. If it's not important enough to change back into uniform for or calling for UCMJ then why are you worrying about it?
Just let the poor guy have his "Me time," we all know soldiers are on duty more often than not nowadays, there's no need to hassle them outside the work place....
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Advice... Go upstairs, grab your big girl panties, and put them on....
Posts: 255 | Location: Fort Campbell, KY | Registered: 15 February 2008
You posted while I was posting... so you just wanted to remind him of the rank structure? Are you serious? He was off post, probably hanging out with his buddies and what? Didn't call you SGT? I'm all about "old army" but damn. That's just a bit ridiculous. If he's off post, in civilians, then just leave him alone. HE'S OFF WORK.
Like I said before, he may have signed himself over when he enlisted but you have to let a person be a person instead of a soldier, that's what off duty is for....
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Advice... Go upstairs, grab your big girl panties, and put them on....
Posts: 255 | Location: Fort Campbell, KY | Registered: 15 February 2008
Funny how people read WAY more into things than they should. Making assumptions isn't a good habit to have. He was hanging with ME and 3 other individuals. He's been dropped more than once by multiple other NCOs. He puts himself into positions like that for the sake of a joke. He decided it'd be funny to pretend to do a Matrix style attack on me because he knows I'm an NCO.
I'm not going to explain his personality because it's just the way he is. A lot of the times he gets dropped is for doing stupid stuff. Nothing serious to warrant real action but like I said, it was needed.
We got back, I told him he owed me 20 for his Matrix move. He thought I was joking, told him I was serious and he came up with the quote I posted before.
We all got a laugh out of it, including him.
The next time you read a message, take it for its face value. Making up information in your head about him being offpost, hanging with his buddies and me "stalking him" does nothing to answer the original question I had which was simple...
Does anyone know if you can or cannot drop someone, legally, while they are not in uniform as long as it is tactfully done.
Originally posted by Vipes: Funny how people read WAY more into things than they should. Making assumptions isn't a good habit to have. He was hanging with ME and 3 other individuals. He's been dropped more than once by multiple other NCOs. He puts himself into positions like that for the sake of a joke. He decided it'd be funny to pretend to do a Matrix style attack on me because he knows I'm an NCO.
I'm not going to explain his personality because it's just the way he is. A lot of the times he gets dropped is for doing stupid stuff. Nothing serious to warrant real action but like I said, it was needed.
We got back, I told him he owed me 20 for his Matrix move. He thought I was joking, told him I was serious and he came up with the quote I posted before.
We all got a laugh out of it, including him.
The next time you read a message, take it for its face value. Making up information in your head about him being offpost, hanging with his buddies and me "stalking him" does nothing to answer the original question I had which was simple...
Does anyone know if you can or cannot drop someone, legally, while they are not in uniform as long as it is tactfully done.
I'm not making stuff up, I'm wondering why you as an NCO were out hanging out with a junior enlisted (I am assuming this since you dropped him) and then when he's joking with you like you're his buddy (which if you're chillin off post, that's what you're acting like) you drop him? If he was just pretending, and you know that's how he is, then why put yourself in the position to get so offended that you feel the need to drop him?
It just seems uncalled for. You're an NCO when it pleases you is what it sounds like. I'm not saying that with sarcasm, I'm saying it from what you just said. Let me clarify, I'm not being little miss sarcastic, seriously, I'm just responding to the way I read your posts.
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Advice... Go upstairs, grab your big girl panties, and put them on....
Posts: 255 | Location: Fort Campbell, KY | Registered: 15 February 2008
I wanna say yes it can be done but its kinda childish to do so. Its one of those things that you can do but nobody really does. As long as he respects you in uniform and at work and he is not breaking any laws, I dont see the issue. I know if I was a Pvt of Spc hanging out with a Sgt or SSgt and he kept pullin the whole 'oh im gonna drop you' card, I would lose respect for him quick. If you dont like what he's doing as far as this whole matrix crap, dont hang out with him. Pretty soon he is going to start taking you and whoever else drops him for dumb shit as a joke. I know I would. Work is work. Fun is fun. If he bugs you, dont hang out with him. Sorry I couldnt be more of a help and I know im coming off as kind of rude but Im really not meaning it to be like that. Put yourself in his shoes.
Posts: 23 | Location: Fort Hood | Registered: 12 September 2008
You are a Soldier 24/7, both on and off post. I am a Noncommissioned Officer 24/7, both on and off post. If a Soldier is not representing the Army in a professional manner or disrespects my rank then yes, I will drop said Soldier. I'm tired of kids coming in the Army and when you see them in the "civi" world you are embarrassed to know that they wear the same uniform as you based off of their actions and the way they carry themselves.
Everyone needs to stop worrying about this kids "feelings" and all that Bull S**t and realize that he disrespected a NCO.
Vipes, I don't have a clear cut answer on whether it is allowed or not. But if he wants to pull that card, put him in PT uniform.
REDLEG81
Posts: 172 | Location: Fort Bliss | Registered: 01 April 2007
I see your point of view but like WhiskeyWife said, you (not you personally) cant be an NCO when its convinient. If he is not supposed to hang out lower enlisted anyways then why is this even an issue? You cant hang out with people your not supposed too and then reprimand them for doing dumb stuff when you shouldnt have been there in the first place.
Posts: 23 | Location: Fort Hood | Registered: 12 September 2008
I don't get it. You can't play buddy one second and then NCO the other when you are hanging out off post. You are sending mixed signals to him. If an NCO was hanging out with me and dropped me for joking around, guess who wouldn't be hanging around anymore. That would prolly lead to an exchange of words off post with me. I would tell ya to knock the sand outta your #$@$& or don't hang out with us anymore. As long as he is professional at work and gives the proper respect I don't see where ya get off doing anything to him when you are hanging out.
I've had NCO's that liked to hang out off duty and joke around. They loved being the Alpha and making the soldier the ass of the jokes, but once it was turned around and they were the ass of a joke shit got serious. This is what sounds like is happening. But I don't have the full story, so I dunno. I just wouldn't have any respect for ya or hang out with ya if you were making me drop while we were hanging out.
"Sic Vis Pacem Para Bellum"
Posts: 193 | Location: Fort Hood | Registered: 10 December 2007
Got the information that I wanted to check on, thanks. Given the fact none of you were there, you have no idea what happened/why, especially since I'm not going to explain everything here. Simple question just called for a simple answer.
This wasn't an inquiry into my leading methods or how I conduct business. If my CSM, 1SG, or PSG had an issue with me, they'd let me know and they don't. Not someone's wife who only has a small peak into a single incident that was actually joking around with soldiers who know me better than you, that are a part of my unit, and work where I do. So, I'm done defending something that doesn't need to be defended.
Just an FYI, NCOs are not forbidden from hanging with junior enlisted. Especially those in a direct interaction position as long as it's all business with the uniform goes on and you're on duty. Hell I went out to drink every Thurs night with an E-6 and 2 E-5s when I was a SPC.
He's giving this soldier mixed signals so to speak. One minute he's a hard ass NCO and the next minute he's his buddy hangin out wherever. It's a bit over the top don't ya think? The fact that this NCO already knows the way this soldier is and chooses to spend time off duty hanging out with him just goes to show that it's not unexpected, almost asked for.
Oh, and FYI, I'm not just someone's wife, I was a soldier too.
That's getting seriously annoying.....
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Advice... Go upstairs, grab your big girl panties, and put them on....
Posts: 255 | Location: Fort Campbell, KY | Registered: 15 February 2008
I get what your saying too, but this NCO is hanging out with this soldier. If we are up in a bar somewhere hanging out, don't expect me to be at parade rest while I'm talking to you. You are likely not even gonna get a "Sergeant" at the beginning and end of a sentence.
Not all soldiers act like what you are talking about off post. You seem like one of those NCOs that sees soldiers and a lower form of a human.
"Sic Vis Pacem Para Bellum"
Posts: 193 | Location: Fort Hood | Registered: 10 December 2007
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