SM has been on profile since the end of Sept. The SM now has another temporary profile (for another 90 days,on a DD3349), pending surgery; stating that they cannot do the PU event for APFT. However, the profile also states they ARE allowed to do the other two events. SM takes an APFT in accordance to this profile, and passes the two allowed events. According to the doctor the SM seen, they passed. The way the score would be generated for the PU event, is that the two scores from the events allowed would be averaged and that would be the PU score. However, now the SM company states that the SM wasn't even supposed to be taking the APFT in the first place. I cannot find WHERE this doctor got his information, or IF he is even correct. Has anyone heard of this circumstance before?
The SM can take a PT test, just not a Record PT test. By regulation, the PT event not taken get's zero points, but some Company's dictate otherwise. The only time that is really authorized to average the 2 events taken for a score in the third event is when a permanant profile SM turns in a Record PT test for promotion board points. I do not have the regulation off hand to back this up, but this should get you started in the right direction to do your own searches in the FM.
So basically the SM took the APFT for a promotion, but it doesn't count.Due to a temporary profile instead of a permanent? Even though, this profile is until after the pending surgery? I can't find anything in the regulations that is in favor of this soldier.
AR 350-1. Don't have it in front of me, just put APFT in the search bar.
If it is for promotion, then the two scores can be averaged since the temporary profile is longer than 3 months.
Also, if this is for promotion, when dealing with promotion the APFT score just has to be within 12 months on day of promotion. So the Soldier can submit an APFT test within 12 months of the board month and receive points. To get promoted all the Soldier would require is a valid APFT within the last 12 months of Promotion Date.
a. Permanent profiles. A profile is considered permanent unless a modifier of “T” (temporary) is added as described in b below. A permanent profile may only be awarded or changed by the authority designated in paragraph 7–6. (1) If the profile is permanent the profiling officer must assess if the Soldier meets retention standards by chapter 3. Those Soldiers on active duty who do not meet retention standards must be referred to an MEB as per chapter 3. (See paras 9–10 and 10–26 for disposition of USAR and ARNG Soldiers not on active duty who do not meet medical retention standards.) (2) Those Soldiers (active duty and USAR/ARNG) who meet retention standards but have at least a 3 or 4 PULHES serial will be referred to a Medical MOS Retention Board (MMRB) in accordance with AR 600–60, unless waived by the MMRB convening authority. (3) Permanent profiles may be amended at any time if clinically indicated and will automatically be reviewed at the time of a Soldier’s periodic health assessment or other medical examination. (4) The Soldier’s commander may also request a review of a permanent profile in accordance with paragraph 7–12. b. Temporary profiles. A temporary profile is given if the condition is considered temporary, the correction or treatment of the condition is medically advisable, and correction usually will result in a higher physical capacity. Soldiers on active duty and RC Soldiers not on active duty with a temporary profile will be medically evaluated at least once every 3 months at which time the profile may be extended for a maximum of 6 months from the initial profile start date by the profiling officer. ((1) Temporary profiles exceeding 6 months duration, for the same medical condition, will be referred to a specialist (for that medical condition) for management and consideration for one of the following actions: (a) Continuation of a temporary profile for a maximum of 12 months from the initial profile start date; (b) Change the temporary profile to a permanent profile; (c) Determination if the Soldier meets the medical retention standards of Chapter 3 and if not, referral to a MEB. (2) The profiling officer must review previous profiles before making a decision to extend a temporary profile and refer the Soldier to a medical specialist for management if the temporary profile has been in effect for 6 month. Any extension of a temporary profile must be recorded on DA Form 3349, and if renewed, item 10 on the DA Form 3349 must contain the following statement: "This temporary profile is an extension of a temporary profile first issued on (date)." (3) Temporary profiles should specify an expiration date. If no date is specified, the profile will automatically expire at the end of 30 days from issuance of the profile. In no case will Soldiers carry a temporary profile that has been extended for more than 12 months. If a profile is needed beyond the 12 months, the temporary profile will be changed to a permanent profile
Posts: 548 | Location: Camp Hovey, Korea | Registered: 23 November 2006
I am being treated for spinal injuries suffered during OEF IX(documented in PDHRA at 30 and 90 days)
I have underwent Epidural Steroid Injections, Selective Nerve Root Blocks, Facet Injections and Physical Therapy since September 2010.
My Specialist says we have exhausted all conservative options and is referring me to Surgery, but does not recommend it since it will most likely be for spinal fusion and there is no certainty that it will resolve the issue and not cause more pain.
He suggested we continue with medication management, perhaps a spinal cord stimulator implant and send me to MEB.
I have no issue with that since I am combat arms and will most likely never again perform on the battlefield without endangering myself or someone else.
The issue is he says local TMC policy prohibits him from issuing a P3 profile. He said he can issue a P2 with Needs MEB checked or T3 with Needs MEB checked, fails to meet retention standards.
Is this accurate? Can the MEB process be initiated with a P2 needs MEB or T3 needs MEB?
Posts: 183 | Location: Ft. Bragg | Registered: 29 October 2007
This is only to clarify the process of calculating points since I have no data to verify the Temporary vs. Permanent profile. For Promotion points purposes only if you do not take either the PU or Sit up event at all you get a score 60 on the event not taken. You do not average it. The only event that allows for an average is the walk, bike, swim in which case you could score a 300. Now if you do not do PU or Sit-ups you can only get a max 260. 100 PU or Sit Up, 60 on the event not taken and 100 on the run. Now lets say you cannot do PU and you walk then you can only get a max of 240 (100 on Sit up, 60 on PU, and average of both on the walk, bike or swim which would be 80) Look at this on AR 600-8-19. I know it sounds crazy and to a certain extent I dont agree but that is what the regulation says. Read carefully because it can get confusing and I have had to clarify this many many times.
CARLY MARQUEZ SSG, USA Human Resources NCO
Posts: 34 | Location: Fort Polk, LA | Registered: 28 January 2011
Check it out..AR 21-20, chapter 14, section 20, states that soldiers on a temp profile take the three event PT test after their profile has expired, and if one is scheduled they should be given a mandatory make up date. Command makes you do what events you can usually, but it cant count against you...same AR same section states you must be given twice the amount of time your profile lasted to train back up for the PT test before you can be required to take a record test...hopethat helps!