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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by TheBarbarian1532:
What rating do you think you deserve and why?

What have you done this rated period to support such rating?


If I had to rate myself, I would say a 2/1. My PT score did dip, but part of that is because of increased office hours. That and I wasn't feeling well the day I took it, but that's how things go sometimes. I'm not going to be one of those that think they're a 1/1 every year, when all they do is show up for work, check email, take a long lunch, and call it a day. I've done way too much for this unit and other units for that. Way too much.

When Cmdrs and Sgts Major are calling you by name to handle projects for them, that's got to mean something. True story. She got mad at that command team because they gave me a coin and not her. Come on, now. What kind of childish s**t is that!

If I didn't point this out before, the NCO side of the house did put up a fight over this, but there wasn't anything they could do. I get rated and senior rated by Officers. What can you do. The burden's up to me to appeal. That's fine. All this is going to do is bring things to light that she's going to wish would've stayed covered up.
 
Posts: 24 | Location: Midwest | Registered: 19 September 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of 98C40_35N40
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quote:
As far as calling someone 'Sarge' on an internet board, that, is informal for the most part (we could be anyone behind these computers...a PVT posing as a 1SG, for example), can't be that big of a deal. If I'm talking to a senior NCO live, of course I go through the proper protocol. Too much (seemingly negative) assumptions are being made here, without even knowing the half of it.


I put my offical Signature block on all my posts for a reason. If you would like to contact my office, and speak to me over the phone to verify, check my ERB, or fly out to my location to verify the truthfulness of my "online presence" the I will help you arrange the travel.

I said nothing out of line. I used the information you gave me to deduce an opinion. You never posted your bullets as you stated you would, you never addressed any of my concerns/questions posed in my very long, well thought out, detailed and researched post to you. It is your job as the underperfoming Soldier to help sway me to your side and convince me to give you proper advice.

All you did is run your mouth, talk shit, get defensive and start name calling.

But you wont try and talk through the situation, you will just keep talking shit, and then cry when people talk shit back. You will maintain your 4/4 (or maybe a 2/2, 3/3 if you get your way) and go on about your life.

I told you to come here with proper questions and the people here would gladly help you. You have STILL yet to do that, seems like you've already earned the "continually missed deadlines and didn't follow through on several projects" bullet on this Internet Forum.

Oh and Congrats on your "coin"; stop by my desk some time and I will make it rain GO coins and tell you how awesome I am, then see if you will be in awe of my greatness... or how about I just send you my NCOERs rated by O-6s and Senior Rater by a Brig Gen.

I dont come here to argue with trolls or people who dont want to listen, I come here to try and help people; check my history.


NCO's Lead The Way!

SFC Nick Martinez
B Co, 3rd MI BN (AE)
Camp Humphreys, KOR

“I am the punishment of God... If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you.” ― Genghis Khan
 
Posts: 273 | Location: HQ J2, USSTRATCOM, Offutt AFB, NE | Registered: 20 April 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of SSG. T
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My, that escalated quickly... My two cents, it's clear a 4/4 isn't your idea of a good NCOER, so go through the appeal process and hopefully you'll get the desired result in the end.

Something you should know, (and this is for future reference)when you come to this forum you will get people's opinions, and for the most part some good factual information pertaining to your current situation. However, you must bare in mind that you won't always get an answer that is palatable.

Last, this is an internet forum that is not governed by any military doctrine what so ever, so in reality all the throwing around of rank, and status is a waste of key strokes in my opinion. PVT to 4 star General, at Armystudyguide.com collars get tucked in and shoulder boards come off, that's coming from your friendly neighborhood buck Sergeant Smiler
 
Posts: 580 | Registered: 29 January 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of Illernoise
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I'll be a dick and jump in here because I see no one else caught it. You say you would give yourself a 2/1. So...if you only perform at a 2 in your current position...how in the hell do you think you can perform at a 1 for promotion and/or a position of GREATER responsibility...just my 2 cents...
 
Posts: 660 | Location: Ft. Drum | Registered: 16 June 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of erikwithak86
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Illernoise:
I'll be a dick and jump in here because I see no one else caught it. You say you would give yourself a 2/1. So...if you only perform at a 2 in your current position...how in the hell do you think you can perform at a 1 for promotion and/or a position of GREATER responsibility...just my 2 cents...


I'll be a dick and respond, do you really think that someone can perform at a 2 and not have the potential to perform at a higher level? By you logic, every NCOER would have exact same rating for performance and potential.
 
Posts: 707 | Registered: 18 June 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of 98C40_35N40
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quote:
Last, this is an internet forum that is not governed by any military doctrine what so ever, so in reality all the throwing around of rank, and status is a waste of key strokes in my opinion. PVT to 4 star General, at Armystudyguide.com collars get tucked in and shoulder boards come off, that's coming from your friendly neighborhood buck Sergeant

I get what you are saying, and sometimes you have to be an asshole back to the people who are full of shit, thats kind of where I went with the whole thing.

And to be fair, I have NEVER stated that anyone should observe the whole rank thing on the internets... I agree that general discussions should be had, with no fear and with candid answers/responses.

quote:
quote:
She's one of those types that tries to please higher, at any expense. That and she has virtually no respect for anyone with less rank than her. Trust me, Sarge, she's not that liked in the unit.
Look at who is talking about a clear and complete lack of respect… the same guy who calls a SFC “Sarge” with the intent to disrespect me and my comments/opinion (on an internet forum or not) I never would have brought the comment up (it honestly doesn’t bother me that much at all) but I wanted to highlight the hypocrisy in your statement. Hey pot, watch what you call the kettle… the truth might burn a bit.


However, when people throw around the "respect" thing (see above quoted text) and show a blatant disrespect to others (in general) then I like to call them out on it.

Bottom line is that dude doesnt like the advice, did nothing to help US help HIM, other than complain and talk shit. I can talk shit with the best of them, and I can throw my weight around on the web too... the only difference is that I can throw it around in real life as well ;-)


NCO's Lead The Way!

SFC Nick Martinez
B Co, 3rd MI BN (AE)
Camp Humphreys, KOR

“I am the punishment of God... If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you.” ― Genghis Khan
 
Posts: 273 | Location: HQ J2, USSTRATCOM, Offutt AFB, NE | Registered: 20 April 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of 98C40_35N40
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Also as an aside:

AR 623-3, Ch 4-13 para b.2:
quote:
b. Once the decision has been made to appeal an evaluation report, the appellate will state succinctly what is being appeal and the basis for the appeal. For example the appellant will state-

(2) The basis for the belief that the rating officials were not objective or had an erroneous perception of his/her performance. Note that a personality conflict between the appellant and a rating official does not constitute grounds for a favorable appeal; it will be shown []b conclusively [/b] that the conflict resulted in an inaccurate or unjust evaluation.
c. Most appellants will never be completely satisfied with the evidence obtained. A point is reached, however, when the appellant will decide whether to submit with the available evidence or to forgo the appeal entirely. The following factors are to be considered:
(1) The evidence must support the allegation. The appellant needs to remember that the case will be reviewed by impartial board members who will be influenced only by the available evidence. Their decision will be based on their best judgment of the evidence provided.


DA PAM 623-3 CH 6-2, para d. 1
quote:
(1) Before finalizing the appeal, an appellant should have the entire package reviewed by a trusted disinterested third party. This third party review may help remove emotionalism and poor logic from the case. The appeal package should not be submitted until the appellant is satisfied that they presented a logical, well-constructed case , as fully documented as possible.


This Solder could have come on here and given us examples of his evidence that he was using to fight the 4/4 on appeal; he could have asked about advice on gathering examples, he could have done tons of things.

If you can’t effectively communicate to a bunch of impartial Army personnel on the internet how do you expect to have an effective appeal?!?!

My first two posts came from an impartial third party who just wanted information on the situation, and asked the same questions anyone else would ask. However instead of using that info to HELP his case, he just ignored it all and went off on his own tangents.

You just can’t help some people.

Lastly it’s worth noting that you can’t even appeal your NCOER until it’s been signed and submitted to HRC. So you might be fighting for nothing at this point.

An appeal to an NCOER is a long, painful process, and believe it or not some of us out there have experience on one, or both sides of the coin. Not being a dick when asking for help will likely ensure that help arrives.


NCO's Lead The Way!

SFC Nick Martinez
B Co, 3rd MI BN (AE)
Camp Humphreys, KOR

“I am the punishment of God... If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you.” ― Genghis Khan
 
Posts: 273 | Location: HQ J2, USSTRATCOM, Offutt AFB, NE | Registered: 20 April 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post

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The reason I brought up the Army Values and getting YES's for all is because if you're given a 4, isn't it possible to be lacking in one or more of them?

If I'm 'continually missing deadlines' and 'did not follow through on SEVERAL projects' is that fulfilling obligations (DUTY)? Is it selfless service? Both of those bullets are BS, btw. She said it because THE BURDEN OF PROOF is not on her.

If you WANT to write a bad NCOER for anyone, you can do it. If you're not looking to screw the person over, you're not going to base it on negatives.

Instead of writing 'missed deadlines' tell the truth that the Soldier is 'taking on multiple projects at once'. Anything can affect a deadline. Stopping to take those mandatory classes, for example. Or a new training event comes up, and you have to partake in that.

Again, unless you're losing equipment, getting people hurt (not following safety protocols), or the Soldier just isn't cutting it, there's no reason to give a sh**ty NCOER. If you do 100 great things, it won't be negated by a couple bad things UNLESS those things are safety related, negligence, or legal trouble. I had NONE of those issues. None. Not a single one. There isn't any counseling to support her claims of missed deadlines. If I did miss these so called deadlines, why was there no counseling (you're not here to see...I'm telling you there was no counseling)? She only said it to fatten up her case.

A negative case against anyone not available to defend themselves or dispute the claim adds legitimacy to it, fake or otherwise. It's like talking bad about a dead man. Like I said, it's easy to screw a Soldier over, if that's the intent. But I have truthful against her lies that she put on a memo (like that sh*t makes them true) . I can prove she was lying...and will do so.
 
Posts: 24 | Location: Midwest | Registered: 19 September 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of JC351LPP4
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Has your First Sergeant and/or Sergeant Major reviewed your NCOER at all?
If so, what did they say?
 
Posts: 344 | Location: Fort Belvoir, VA | Registered: 01 November 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post

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They put eyes on it, but what can they do? I'm rated by Officers.

Right now it's a one-sided story. Right now. That's going to change, and I have supporting documents that will make her have to answer questions.
 
Posts: 24 | Location: Midwest | Registered: 19 September 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post

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You started this post a week ago,(nearly 7 days claiming you have proof)have you presented those supporting documents to anyone yet?
 
Posts: 468 | Registered: 08 November 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of TheWiseChief
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by BigSarge442:
They put eyes on it, but what can they do? I'm rated by Officers.

Right now it's a one-sided story. Right now. That's going to change, and I have supporting documents that will make her have to answer questions.


As an officer, I have had senior NCOs provide suggestions on the write-up. Nobody can change a write-up per regulation but if that 4/4 was not warranted per your statements; then somebody along the way (especially you) should have addressed it before being submitted to HRC. You control your write-up; nobody else.
 
Posts: 1902 | Registered: 04 February 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of 98C40_35N40
posted Hide Post
quote:
You started this post a week ago,(nearly 7 days claiming you have proof)have you presented those supporting documents to anyone yet?


I keep asking to see what he has to try and help, but alas nothign will come of it. I even provided regualtory guidance and everything.

Like I said it will likely come down to no change, and we will never see the BigSarge442 again.


NCO's Lead The Way!

SFC Nick Martinez
B Co, 3rd MI BN (AE)
Camp Humphreys, KOR

“I am the punishment of God... If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you.” ― Genghis Khan
 
Posts: 273 | Location: HQ J2, USSTRATCOM, Offutt AFB, NE | Registered: 20 April 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of 35 Series
posted Hide Post
I just read this whole thread for funsies.

I have given a 5/5 before, but hey, they earned it.

I applaud this "crappy" officer for not inflating your ego and NCOER like most people do. Most people allow mediocre Soldiers to get by with zero accountability.

I find it hard to believe that at the very least three raters and a 1SG (probably if your rater is a CPT, then the reviewer might be outside of the company, which means at least one CSM should have eyes on) allowed a CPT to just berate you on your NCOER...just doesn't seem likely to me.

I have reviewed hundreds of NCOERs at this point over the last 15 months as 1SG and prior to that I had 28 months of PSG...the last platoon that had 30 NCOs and over 80 total Soldiers. I don't say all that to brag, I've just really gone over tons and tons of NCOERs and I haven't even been looked at for MSG yet.

And I never let me NCOs get away with stuff like that...or officers. I mean, sure, I can't force anyone to change anything that is factually correct or whatnot, but I kick it back and say - look, this isn't justified. If you want to send it up that way, I can't stop you, but this is what I'd say...

And if someone on the other end feels strong enough they send it up. Meaning, in your case, someone somewhere would have been like "no way, this isn't justified" if it wasn't. Or at least mostly justified.


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"an Army Linguist" - Resources and more about being an Army linguist
 
Posts: 2327 | Location: CONUS | Registered: 30 October 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post

Picture of SSG. T
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Something that I've heard of in the past is the fact that this officer may not fully understand the gravity of a 4/4 rating. A 4/4 is "fair", and she may be interpreting it in the literal sense of the word "fair". Granted the Senior rater and reviewer as well as any NCO worth his/her salt that laid eyes on it must have concluded a 4/4 was justified.
 
Posts: 580 | Registered: 29 January 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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