NCOPD Hot Topic in my unit

I attended yet another NCOPD conducted by the CSM. To make a long discussion, short, one of her 1SGs was called to the front to speak.

So the 1SG came up front and he brought one of his SR NCOs and told us a story of how their SR NCO went to a NCOES school, was not a walk-in, was allowed to stay and graduated. And, oh, by the way this same SR NCO just got promoted a month prior

I spoke with some buddies of mine who were very moved by the story. She said, "So that's what that, "Among the best block means at the bottom of the NCOER, showing some guts as well as determinination to stick your neck out and dig in the fox hole despite the odds.

I, being a skeptic, think it was a, Good ol boy hook-up. I didn't tell my buddy that because she is really working hard and very determine to be a great leader.

What advice should I give my buddy?
Original Post
I dont get it. Are you saying somebody went to an NCOES school and passed and didnt know they were supposed to be going? Sorta like a last minute shoe in? Your also saying this soldier got promoted a month prior to going to school? Which NCOES school was it? When I went to WLC one of the guys I went with was on CQ the night prior and he got pulled off CQ recovery to go to school. Really sucked for him but he still graduated. I didn't think the guy was a hero though for doing so.
quote:
Originally posted by Erik68WM6:
I dont get the scenario either oldschool. Can u give it again?

Man, way back in the day..when i went through..(02)....they called it PLDC.....lol


The SR NCO went to the 1SG course and had just made the E-8 list. My apolpgy for not being specific about the school not PLDC/WLC. My buddy was impressed that the SR NCO went, was not kicked out,was not on the list to go until later on in the year and graduated. His determination in their eyes an example of a true leader who did not take "no" for an answer.
The conversation of the block on the NCOER came up.

My buddy is a newly promoted NCO and sees NCOERS on a daily basis and thinks that a NCO has to stick their neck out and bust your butt to be a perfect leader and get the excellent blocks and the "among the best" block.
quote:
Originally posted by frank82:
I dont get it. Are you saying somebody went to an NCOES school and passed and didnt know they were supposed to be going? Sorta like a last minute shoe in? Your also saying this soldier got promoted a month prior to going to school? Which NCOES school was it? When I went to WLC one of the guys I went with was on CQ the night prior and he got pulled off CQ recovery to go to school. Really sucked for him but he still graduated. I didn't think the guy was a hero though for doing so.


I bet he was. Just like the SR NCO I was trying to talk about. That SR NCO was a hero to his peers and his 1SG during that NCOPD just wanted to show him off. I guess he was trying to show the other NCOs in the audience that you should always stay ready and very knowledgeable about the basic soldiering just in case you are chose among the best to attend a course like the 1SG Course, Battle Staff, ANCOC as a SSG, etc.
Your damn ****ing right you better stay ready on BASIC SOLDIERING 24/7. That's what this **** is all about, period. **** the bull****. You show me any soldier who CAN NOT take apart and re-assemble the M16. A soldier who can NOT pass a PT test, with 10 minutes notice, A soldier who can not march an element on immediate command, and call the cadence for the troops. A soldier who can NOT call up a 9 line medevac request. A soldier who can not triage casualties without thinking about it. You show me a soldier who can not do ALL of those, Ill tell you they are SUB-standard. But even if they could do all those WITH perfection....does that mean they are squared away...ok maybe...but a HERO??? Oh helllll no.

HERO???? HERO???? that NCO is not a damn hero at all. To be honest, it hurts to even hear ANYONE SAY THAT....it truly does... He or She is the standard. Not even above it....nope. Thats just a standard, thats all. Dropping the standards to create more "hero's" thats BS to me.

Hero??? Hero??? I don't know how many purple hearts or lives he/she saved. But id sure not pin the "hero" badge on for that. That should be expected of all soldiers. Im sorry, but with what i saw there, and have seen back here as a care provider now(i work the #1 Military Burn Ward--Intense Critical Care Unit)....and how humble some soldiers are with 1 leg and no arms to be serving the country, and how proud they still are. Still asking how long it will take for them to heal up, so they can get back to IRAQ with their unit's. The hell if some nco who "excells" at an NCOES school is gonna be a HERO. You gotta be crazy. Not in my book, takes a hell of alot more than that.
I grew up outside of a military base so before I joined the Army every soldier was a hero too me. The day I get out I will probably feel the same way. I guess being in and being soldiers ourselves we dont look at ourselves as heros because we see some of the substandard soldiers out there. Its off topic but it was in reference to what erik68wm6 said. It just made me think of what I used to think of a hero.
I didn't mean to go "soap-box" on that one. I just know there are some soldiers out there that are not even old enuf to drink, getting hit by IED's...and most of em truly love being an american and a soldier more than anything......and some 3000+ less fortunate that are no longer, who gave their life..for the USA. So just hearing the slightest whisper of "hero" in relatin to some NCOES school got to me a lil....lol thats all. Sorry to of twisted the topic around, etc. I guess I just feel that word has alot of respect associated with-it...and (MY opinion) passing an NCOES school with flying colors is no where near worth of the word "hero".
I think what happened here is, the NCO was promoted to MSG/E8 and it is quite possible selected for a First Sergeant position immediately or in the near future. In that case, the individual would need to attend the 1SG Course to be qualified to hold that position. Regulation AR 614-200 will help you beter understand the selection criteria and pre-requisites. But whether the individual went one month after promotion or one year is honestly irrelevant unless they were bumpe dup on the Order of Merit list for unjustifiable or unfair reasons.
quote:
Originally posted by OC_ipap:
Your damn ****ing right you better stay ready on BASIC SOLDIERING 24/7. That's what this **** is all about, period. **** the bull****. You show me any soldier who CAN NOT take apart and re-assemble the M16. A soldier who can NOT pass a PT test, with 10 minutes notice, A soldier who can not march an element on immediate command, and call the cadence for the troops. A soldier who can NOT call up a 9 line medevac request. A soldier who can not triage casualties without thinking about it. You show me a soldier who can not do ALL of those, Ill tell you they are SUB-standard. But even if they could do all those WITH perfection....does that mean they are squared away...ok maybe...but a HERO??? Oh helllll no.

HERO???? HERO???? that NCO is not a damn hero at all. To be honest, it hurts to even hear ANYONE SAY THAT....it truly does... He or She is the standard. Not even above it....nope. Thats just a standard, thats all. Dropping the standards to create more "hero's" thats BS to me.

Hero??? Hero??? I don't know how many purple hearts or lives he/she saved. But id sure not pin the "hero" badge on for that. That should be expected of all soldiers. Im sorry, but with what i saw there, and have seen back here as a care provider now(i work the #1 Military Burn Ward--Intense Critical Care Unit)....and how humble some soldiers are with 1 leg and no arms to be serving the country, and how proud they still are. Still asking how long it will take for them to heal up, so they can get back to IRAQ with their unit's. The hell if some nco who "excells" at an NCOES school is gonna be a HERO. You gotta be crazy. Not in my book, takes a hell of alot more than that.
LOL...agreed. I really don't see the point of the story. That's like someone being thought of as great for passing a PT test.

All I could think of as I was trying to figure where the guy was a "hero" was "BFD." If you don't know what it stands for, think for a minute.
Mmmm... he took a chance and went to the school early hoping the class was not filled, got in, and graduated. Okay... doesn't change much. He will be right back to Master Sarge as soon as his time is up as Top. And will work a staff job or something for a while...so on and so on. The diamond is a symbol of distinction but you don't keep it forever. I would be more interested to know if he was the Honor Grad. Do they have those for that school too? Anyway, i think I am repeating what was already said.
I just wanted to hear other senior NCO's opinon on who should attend NCOPDs. I am currently stationed at Ft. Stewart, I,ve been and NCO (E-5) for two years now. I have yet been to one as in this BDE there only held for SSG. I have voiced my opinon on the issue with a few of my seniors, most of which do not really have a response. At what point are junior NCO's worthy of attending what I thought was an developmental tool for all NCO's. I feel as though that seperates the corp, as when E-4 and below hear this that it degrads the the grade and position of the E-5. Any thoughts.
quote:
Originally posted by OneStepAhead:
I just wanted to hear other senior NCO's opinon on who should attend NCOPDs. I am currently stationed at Ft. Stewart, I,ve been and NCO (E-5) for two years now. I have yet been to one as in this BDE there only held for SSG. I have voiced my opinon on the issue with a few of my seniors, most of which do not really have a response. At what point are junior NCO's worthy of attending what I thought was an developmental tool for all NCO's. I feel as though that seperates the corp, as when E-4 and below hear this that it degrads the the grade and position of the E-5. Any thoughts.


Huh?
This thread had not much in common with your question. You'd get better answers by starting your own thread.

It's totally up to the CSM and 1SG what level NCOPDs are. I've seen some Battalions do some for SFC and up while the Company does ALL NCOs.

Talk with your firstline and/or 1SG, ask when you can get some NCOPD..
@ 2ID - I know this was posted a couple years ago but who are you to judge who a person considers a hero? Lots of people have heros who are celebrities and sports figures but do they really do anything that "extraordinary?" Not really but people aspire to be at that level of success. So for this person, that NCO was a hero probably because he/she hasn't seen a NCO worth modeling after.

Do you know how much "basic soldiering" isn't done anymore? I know plenty of soldiers who don't know cadence, can't march troops but because of constantly having to train for deployments every other year and then being deployed, that stuff gets thrown aside. Is it right? No it is not. But saying a soldier who "can not pass a PT test with 10 minutes notice" is "sub-standard" is not an accurate portrayal. I recently failed a PT test an ran 22 minutes. Am I proud of it? No but I've had back and shoulder issues which have plagued me for well over 3 years and attempted to get them fixed but was not helped by the medical staff in my old unit. The PA didn't really do much and we had to go through our medics before we could even go to sick call. Plus you have the mindset in the Army that soldiers who go to sick call are "shamming" basically due to the fact that there are people who aren't hurt who have abused the medical system. So I just "sucked it up" and drove on and it's gotten worse to the point I'm having troubles with my run when I never have. I just get tired of people basing PT on how "great" a soldier is. My old soldier was a PT stud but that kid did not know his job to save his life and refused to listen to me as the only other MI NCO in our BN and had been doing the job as a 35F for 3 years before he got there and had deployed. Being great at PT doesn't mean you're an awesome soldier.

And I guarantee you ask anyone who got a Purple Heart and they won't think they are a hero. Most other soldiers I've talked to don't want a Purple Heart. I've been told by civilians they think I'm a "hero" just for being in and of course I am embarassed to hear it and don't think I am. How many firefighters, policemen get thanked or called heros? Hell I think even teachers should be considered heroes for taking on that job especially in our school systems today.

The point is - hero is defined by the person. You might not see who he/she was talking about as a hero but they do and to try and take that from the person is shameful to me. I don't call too many people heroes that I know. I think a hero is someone who does something extraordinary given the circumstances and goes above and beyond.

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