Retention Control Point and severence pay

I was under the impression if separated by RCP as a SGT E-5 the Army would pay out a severance pay to that Soldier. My PLT SGT today informed me that it is only for indefinite term E-6es (he said the policy recently changed) which made absolutely no sense to me since an indefinite E-6 would be serving to retirement tenure.

Can any Career Counselors or Soldiers that deal a lot with RCP confirm or deny weather a severance is issued to E-5's who hit RCP?
Original Post
quote:
Originally posted by Corvette1140:
I was under the impression if separated by RCP as a SGT E-5 the Army would pay out a severance pay to that Soldier. My PLT SGT today informed me that it is only for indefinite term E-6es (he said the policy recently changed) which made absolutely no sense to me since an indefinite E-6 would be serving to retirement tenure.

Can any Career Counselors or Soldiers that deal a lot with RCP confirm or deny weather a severance is issued to E-5's who hit RCP?


Corvette, i thought you were a a SSG already?
It just came up in a casual conversation with my PLT SGT when I had mentioned that some other Soldiers will at least be getting a severance pay if they hit RCP.

I completely follow how RCP can prevent a Soldier from re-enlistment, but I was under the impression if it is reached and the Soldier has over 10 years that they get some type of so-sad-too-bad money. At least that is how it was handled in 2003.
Soldiers who ETS because they are denied reenlistment due to RPC are authorized Half Separation Pay.

DODI 1332.29

3.2. Half Separation Pay (Non-disability). Half payment of non-disability
separation pay, computed as provided in paragraph 3.3., below, is authorized to members
of the Regular and Reserve components involuntarily separated from AD who meet each
of following four conditions:

3.2.3. The Service member is being involuntarily separated by the Military
Service concerned through either the denial of reenlistment or the denial of continuation
on AD or full-time National Guard duty, or the Service member is being separated
instead of board action as provided in DoD Directive 1332.30 (reference (f)), under one
of the following specific conditions:
3.2.3.1. The member is not fully qualified for retention and is denied
reenlistment or continuation by the Military Service concerned as provided for in
reference (e) or DoD Directive 1332.30 (reference (f)) under any of the following
conditions:
3.2.3.1.1. Expiration of service obligation.

Though I didn't copy and paste it, in order to qualify, the Soldier must have served at least 6 years AFS.
quote:
Info Copied from ALARACT 020/2011

5. SOLDIERS NOT SERVING ON AN INDEFINITE REENLISTMENT, WHO REACH THEIR RCP DURING
THEIR CURRENT ENLISTMENT AGREEEMENT THROUGH LENGTH OF SERVICE, REDUCTION IN
GRADE, OR BY REMOVAL FROM A PROMOTION LIST (EITHER VOLUNTARY OR INVOLUNTARY) WILL
PERFORM ACTIVE SERVICE UNTIL THEIR CONTRACTED EXPIRATION TERM OF SERVICE (ETS),
UNLESS THEY ARE SEPARATED EARLIER UNDER APPLICABLE ADMINISTRATIVE, PHYSICAL
DISABILITY, OR UNIFORM CODE OF MILITARY JUSTICE (UCMJ) SEPARATION PROVISIONS.


@ SIGYEO, how do you interpret that as precluding separation pay. It never even mentions it. All that's saying is they can serve until contructual ETS.
quote:
Originally posted by Homeless Guy:
Had to change your Siggy eh? I guess you can say:

What's the difference between a SGT (P) and a SSG?

I get to stay in uniform for three more years then you do!

Bad joke too soon? Good job on your Staff Sergeant


3? Try 5, right? Hehehe...thanks!
quote:
Originally posted by rwburns3rd:
Tough question to the Career Counselor. Indef E6 reduced to E5 who hits 13 years in a couple of months. Will this person be RCP'd or allowed to retire at 20 years? Or does he have the choice?


RCP'd unless he gets promoted again
Rank (Nonwaiverable).

(1) A Soldier may not exceed the retention control points as shown below, by more than 29 days before expiration of contracted service (reenlistment or extension).

(2) Except for Soldiers serving indefinite reenlistments, Soldiers who reach their RCP during their current enlistment agreement, either through length of service, reduction in rank, or by removal from a promotion list, whether voluntary or involuntary, may serve until contracted Expiration Term of Service (ETS), unless they are separated earlier under applicable administrative, physical disability, or UCMJ separation provisions. Soldiers in this category who are eligible may apply for retirement. Soldiers with less than 18 years AFS serving indefinite reenlistments who exceed RCP as the result of a reduction in rank may serve to minimum retirement eligibility unless they are separated earlier under applicable administrative, physical disability, or UCMJ separation provisions.

(3) (Policy Message 07-01) Rescinded.

(4) Rank eligibility does not apply to Soldiers selected for attendance at an officer training program (that is, Officer Candidate School or Warrant Officer Flight Training).



I pulled this from armyreenlistment.com.....adept please don't go blindly shooting bad info from the hip.
This quote is not the entire story...
It does not address the specifics of reaching high year of tenure (rcp).
The correct direct reference is actually found here:
http://comptroller.defense.gov/fmr/07a/07a_35.pdf
and is DoD Financial Management Regulation Volume 7A, Chapter 35. Notice that the last update to this regulation was June 2010 as opposed to a more recent update of September, 2011 for the below quoted reference....however, here's the problem.
If you go to the this reference:
http://comptroller.defense.gov/fmr/07b/07b_04.pdf which is Volume 7B, Chapter 4, the last update is January 2012.
Separation pay, referenced with a direct link in para 0404 points to Volume 7A, Chapter 35.

Nowhere in the below quotes does it mention high year of tenure or rcp.

Now, go to page 35-14 of Volume 7A, Chapter 35.
Read down through it. There are several qualification points, but the most notable one pertaining to full separation pay for those who have reached rcp can be found on page 35-15 as follows:
3. A member who is separated involuntarily through either the denial of reenlistment or the denial of continuation on active duty or full-time National Guard duty must meet one of the following four specific conditions:
a. The member must be fully qualified for retention but denied reenlistment or continuation. This includes a Military Service member who is eligible for promotion as established by the Secretary of the Military Service concerned, but is denied reenlistment or continuation on active duty under established promotion or high year of tenure policies.

See what I mean?

If you continue reading this same regulation, you will actually find the earlier version of the below quoted reference toward the bottom of page 35-16.
Again, in both the old and newer versions of the below quoted reference, notice the absence of any mention of high year of tenure or rcp concerning those eligible for half separation pay...

Just my two cents.

quote:
Originally posted by ReUp63:
Soldiers who ETS because they are denied reenlistment due to RPC are authorized Half Separation Pay.

DODI 1332.29

3.2. Half Separation Pay (Non-disability). Half payment of non-disability
separation pay, computed as provided in paragraph 3.3., below, is authorized to members
of the Regular and Reserve components involuntarily separated from AD who meet each
of following four conditions:

3.2.3. The Service member is being involuntarily separated by the Military
Service concerned through either the denial of reenlistment or the denial of continuation
on AD or full-time National Guard duty, or the Service member is being separated
instead of board action as provided in DoD Directive 1332.30 (reference (f)), under one
of the following specific conditions:
3.2.3.1. The member is not fully qualified for retention and is denied
reenlistment or continuation by the Military Service concerned as provided for in
reference (e) or DoD Directive 1332.30 (reference (f)) under any of the following
conditions:
3.2.3.1.1. Expiration of service obligation.

Though I didn't copy and paste it, in order to qualify, the Soldier must have served at least 6 years AFS.
Its not so much a 'proof' of both points as a verification that some Soldiers are getting screwed out of half their severance pay by DFAS because of whoever is preparing their DD214 (putting in the wrong codes).
Good luck to them trying to get the rest of their money now....

I've personally seen Soldiers get out with full severance after serving past their RCP, then turning around and signing up for the obligatory years in the reserve, which is also discussed in the reg I quoted in my last.
does it go by total years federal service or active service when figuring the severance pay? for example lets say I dont get promoted in the next 6 years and I hit 15 as a E5/P,I will have 15 years active time and 18 years total federal service due to reserve time. That would be several thousand dollars difference for me!
quote:
Originally posted by fivepointnine:
does it go by total years federal service or active service when figuring the severance pay? for example lets say I dont get promoted in the next 6 years and I hit 15 as a E5/P,I will have 15 years active time and 18 years total federal service due to reserve time. That would be several thousand dollars difference for me!




Go to this link:
http://comptroller.defense.gov/fmr/07a/07a_35.pdf

Read the very last line on page 35-19 and all of page 35-20...
a. The member must be fully qualified for retention but
denied reenlistment or continuation. This includes a Military Service member who is eligible for
promotion as established by the Secretary of the Military Service concerned, but is denied
reenlistment or continuation on active duty under established promotion or high year of tenure
policies.
b

according to this it looks like someone separated under RCP would be eligible for full severance, does this sound right?
quote:
Originally posted by fivepointnine:
a. The member must be fully qualified for retention but
denied reenlistment or continuation. This includes a Military Service member who is eligible for
promotion as established by the Secretary of the Military Service concerned, but is denied
reenlistment or continuation on active duty under established promotion or high year of tenure
policies.
b

according to this it looks like someone separated under RCP would be eligible for full severance, does this sound right?



Yep. That's why I responded the way I did on my other posts here. If there are Soldiers getting cut loose at RCP with half severance instead of full, they are getting screwed...
Good luck trying to get that fixed....but whoever is filling out the codes on their DD214 that tell DFAS what to pay them in terms of severance is not doing it right.

I personally called DFAS and asked some pointed questions about this a while back. They made it very clear to me that their job isn't to investigate what is given to them for accuracy or compliane with regs, but only to pay or not pay based on what is on the paperwork.

The regulation very clearly says that those not allowed to continue service through reenlistment based off high year of tenure are entitled to full severance pay.
quote:
Originally posted by Corvette1140:
So what separation codes should be used to insure full severance on DD 214?



That's a great question that I unfortunately don't have the answer to...

DFAS refused to tell me and my S1 was unhelpful...whether that was because they didn't want to be bothered by little 'ol me or because of something else, I can't say....but when the time comes, you can be sure I'll be getting that answer and my DD214 will be correct.

Anyone else care to chime in with a better answer to the coding?
looks like you should have a RE code of 2B or 2C so its not negative, and the codes should probably be something along the lines of end of term or something, you should not have ANY negative coding, you did nothing wrong! You will probably want to double tap with S1, but this is what makes sense to me.
quote:
Originally posted by fivepointnine:
a. The member must be fully qualified for retention but
denied reenlistment or continuation. This includes a Military Service member who is eligible for
promotion as established by the Secretary of the Military Service concerned, but is denied
reenlistment or continuation on active duty under established promotion or high year of tenure
policies.
b

according to this it looks like someone separated under RCP would be eligible for full severance, does this sound right?


I found a very interesting memorandum dated September 2011 that clarifies what constitutes half-pay and full pay, and unless superceded by something I cannot find, *very* clearly states that RCP qualifies for FULL pay:
http://armypubs.army.mil/epubs/pdf/ad2011_18.pdf
Hope that can help someone.
Good Afternoon SSG V

As I was reading through your posts on RCP, I understood why I am being denied my seperation pay. But, my situation is a little more serious; my ERB has my promotion number on it but I am not promotable in PPW and with 14 years AFS and 2 days less 11 years active duty time, I was told that I do not qualify for seperation pay. I am in the process of getting the sudo-promotion removed from my ERB but it might take time that I do not have left on active duty.
Any suggestions???
However, where can i get a list of the codes and their meanings to safe guard myself against a bad code
New reg on involuntary separation pay

http://www.armytimes.com/story...ration-pay/83647488/

As more soldiers are told the leave, the Army has tried to simplify its guidance for receiving involuntary separation pay.

Laws, directives and policies governing special pays for soldiers who are getting the boot have been consolidated in an entirely new regulation, AR 637-2.

The regulation, Separation Pay (Nondisability) and Levels of Payment, was published April 21, and will take effect May 21.

It applies to Regular Army, Army National Guard and Army Reserve officers and enlisted soldiers who are on active duty or active service.

Until now there has not been a regulation focused specifically on the federal law (Title 10 USC, 1174) and Defense Department policies (DODI 133.2.29) governing involuntary separation pay.

Read more at the above link

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